Daily Telegraph vents on encryption...

[ivahri]

I'm thinking NSWFB will probly have some channels encrypted as will NSWAS but their general duties will remain digital in the clear...

Railcorp might have their BAS and their CNI Security channel encrypted..

I am only guessing here as to what will happen, and have no inside knowledge of any kind what so ever..

Encryption can be implemented on a per radio basis as well as per talkgroup. I think you will find the agencies you mention will use encryption in a limited way as and when its needed, quite possibly custom programming radios for specific operations. Examples would be raids on Meth Labs & joint operations with Police (such as those recently involving the bikie gangs). These are cases where encryption is necessary but for every day operations the information gained from listening is not of much value to most crims. I'm also speaking from my own opinion and not on behalf of my agency as they may have different ideas. Encryption keys are a big job to maintain properly, even with OTAR and a team of techs. To me there is little point implementing encryption half cocked, but then an issue like this may end up being managed centrally on behalf of the agencies... I don't think the idea of moving technical support in to a common group or even outsourcing it is beyond the realms of possibility.

Cheers,


Richard

[soupbones]

Soupbones,

Well for me it is a simple balancing act. If encryption means that it is more difficult for the bad guys to know what is happening as it happens, then game over. And it does. Note that I write more difficult, not impossible, because clearly if someone wants to do something hard enough they will find a way- but it makes it far less easy as simply buying a scanner or, more close to where I sit, knocking off a radio. No key, no point stealing a radio. That IS in the taxpayers interests and in the interests of the safety of those who rely on radios to do their job. So sorry you can babble on about conspiracy theories as much as you like, but some of us live in the real world. And I would put my knowledge of public affairs against yours or anyone else's any day of the week... so knock off the derogatory sheep insult. I'm nobody's sheep, including yours.
But anyway... who really cares about this discussion? Get the hint... encryption is here to stay & will only become more used over time.

Cheers,


Richard

I find your statements interesting, considering I did not give out any 'conspiracy theories' as you called it, but stated an incident which happened and is fact. If you have such knowledge of public affairs, go check up on it. No conspiracy theories involved, and I am not really one for them.
That said, the 'sheep' comment seems to have slightly offended you, so there may be some truth to it, but don't be offended, there are many many sheep in our community and so many people are ignorant on various issues its not funny. And if you don't believe or see this, then maybe you are a bit of a sheep on various subjects.
Of course encryption is here to stay, and the majority of the public would probably agree that its better for the crims to not be able to listen in then do so. But it does not take away from the fact that the police now have another layer of security to hide under, and therefore if they do stuff up in some way, they are not as accountable. My previous example, the one you called a 'conspiracy theory' is proof of these things. And these things do happen, not just here, but in other parts of the world too. Corruption unfortunately is a fact of life in police forces, and NSW or any Australian police force would have some level of corruption.
And to think that those who participate in this corruption would not take advantage of the security given to them in other areas if the situation arose, in my opinion, are ignorant to the fact.

[Chrisco]

theres no corruption in the NSW Govt!....

[soupbones]

Hahahaha No. Just Indonesia. They don't have it either....

[citabria]

theres no corruption in the NSW Govt!....

Sure there is!! I watched underbelly!

[BerryV]

To me there is little point implementing encryption half cocked

Half Cocked ? ROFL, come on Richard, I'm rolling on the floor here. Half cocked is exactly what we have got in NSW.

Just look at the basket case of a radio network we have here. We have tree loppers(SES) wanting full P25 GRN, RFS wanting to join NSWFB as some sort of crack squad chasing bin fires with P25 encrypted radios. Any JIRT involving the Chemical Operations Unit, CDIU(NSW Pol) or any other "special" unit and NSW Fire/ambo's is an easy fix, NSW police simply hand over radios already keyed as required.

Next we will have NPWS, or the local council rangers wanting to jump on so they don't get left out.

I do like one thing though, the idea of getting all the rif raff off the "old" GRN, putting them on "new" full P25. Then shifting the police onto the "old" proven network sounds like a nice plan.

[Longreach]

Hi all, as far as im concerned, conspiricy theories or otherwise, encryption on general channels are a joke. to me it means you HAVE SOMETHING TO HIDE. all for it on special ops channels but normal working channels NO.
i read with interest the next instalment in the telegraph today and the take from one of the NYPD chiefs, and whole heartitly agree. i do listen and take notice on whats going on. with what i hear i make decisions on what i do or where i go. prior listening on the radio meant i didnt buy a house in a bad neighbourhood.
as for the arguement of it hepls security wise, why is NYPD, LAPD, chicago etc all still 'in the clear' so to speak? there are even streams available in the US that are direct feed of the agency. the way i see it encryption only serves to sanitise what we see at 6 o'clock every night, only have to look at WIN news from Canberra to see that.
as for the arugement of 'i dont want to hear my details over the radio' dont do nothing wrong and you dont have to worry.

I realise its coming, i'd just like to see restraint on how its used. as i said above it just seems to me that people have something to hide.
my 2c
Matt

[centralcoastscanman]

I hope your joking about your comment with the SES being tree loppers, as that went out the window some time ago as tree contractors were whinging ses were doing them out of their living...

RFS Wanting to join NSWFB, I take it you never read the white paper that was released by RFSA about 5-7 years ago... that was funny as it made mention of how RFS wanted to do VR, RCR, Hazmat etc... it was about 100-200 pages but well worth a cack if you can get your hands on it...

[ivahri]

Time I think I stopped contributing to this forum... I'm far too ignorant for contribute here. I don't come here to be insulted by people who hide behind anonymity. Go find another source for information because this source has better things to do.

Cheers,


Richard

[BerryV]

I hope your joking about your comment with the SES being tree loppers, as that went out the window some time ago as tree contractors were whinging ses were doing them out of their living...

no, i'm not joking. RFS should leave the real fire guys to do their jobs. a prepaid mobile from woolworths costs $80 with $20 credit. Give the RFS guys 2 each (one for each pocket)and hand back the $2000 radios.

RFS Wanting to join NSWFB, I take it you never read the white paper that was released by RFSA about 5-7 years ago... that was funny as it made mention of how RFS wanted to do VR, RCR, Hazmat etc... it was about 100-200 pages but well worth a cack if you can get your hands on it...

Ive had a read of plenty of things over time and had a listen to lots of dribble. Give the RFS guys a low band VHF radio to take home along with a tone pager. thats all they need.