Daily Telegraph vents on encryption...

[Bigfella237]

Yes but even if PEATS ("Police External Agencies Transfer System" for those who were wondering) is working, the media ONLY have access to what the police allow them to have access to!

The issue here is in the form of censorship. IMO that's what the debate is all about... the media formerly got ALL the info and they were the ones who decided what was newsworthy and what wasn't... now they are only being thrown a few crumbs here and there?

Now I'm not saying that encryption is a bad thing, in fact if Mr plod pulls me over I'd rather not have thousands of people (other than LEAs) hear my private details broadcast on an open channel (not that they would hear anything too bad ) but I'm just saying that I can see the media's side of the argument.

Unfortunately for the media (and we hobbyists) encryption is here to stay and is only going to become more widespread, especially if/when the NSWPF move to the GRN, most of the state (as opposed to just the metro areas) will go encrypted virtually overnight!

Andrew

[soupbones]

Soupbones, the media DOES have access- the problem that the Telegraph is complaining about is that it isn't working. Have you heard of media feeds? They get a feed straight off the back of our operator audio...

Sorry, I think those who carry on about police states are a bunch of w*nkers who spend too much time listening to a scanner & not out and about with the people who protect their lives. But as I said before who really cares because nobody is listening to the anti-encryption nutters anyway...

Cheers,

Richard

Unfortunately, PEATS is only as good as what information the police feed into it, which is of course their main concern. If they had proper access to the encrypted GD channels then they would not even ant to waste their time with PEATS.
And as for those who think this is an issue, they are not really nutters, but people who are more aware the the rest of the sheep that call them selves tax payers.

[ivahri]

Soupbones,

Well for me it is a simple balancing act. If encryption means that it is more difficult for the bad guys to know what is happening as it happens, then game over. And it does. Note that I write more difficult, not impossible, because clearly if someone wants to do something hard enough they will find a way- but it makes it far less easy as simply buying a scanner or, more close to where I sit, knocking off a radio. No key, no point stealing a radio. That IS in the taxpayers interests and in the interests of the safety of those who rely on radios to do their job. So sorry you can babble on about conspiracy theories as much as you like, but some of us live in the real world. And I would put my knowledge of public affairs against yours or anyone else's any day of the week... so knock off the derogatory sheep insult. I'm nobody's sheep, including yours.
But anyway... who really cares about this discussion? Get the hint... encryption is here to stay & will only become more used over time.

Cheers,


Richard

[centralcoastscanman]

Not all government agencies will go encrypted, as was explained to me at work by the GCIO big wigs... there is a fair bit of work involved in setting up crypto keys uploading them to radios and having the facility available to change the key if it gets comprimised...

end result, some agencies will just upgrade their radios and go over to digital as they probly cannot justify going encrypted... examples being SES,RFS, Energy Australia, Railcorp ...

I'm thinking NSWFB will probly have some channels encrypted as will NSWAS but their general duties will remain digital in the clear...

Railcorp might have their BAS and their CNI Security channel encrypted..

I am only guessing here as to what will happen, and have no inside knowledge of any kind what so ever..

[rustynswrail]

Railcorp might have their BAS and their CNI Security channel encrypted....

I can say with 100 percent certainity that the 'BAS' TG will not be encrypted.

Russell

[Bigfella237]

~ end result, some agencies will just upgrade their radios and go over to digital as they probly cannot justify going encrypted... examples being SES,RFS, Energy Australia, Railcorp ~

Funny you should mention that, there are two P25 GRN TGs that have been reported here with encrypted traffic (40051 & 40052) which are very close to an SES assignment of TGs (starting at 40068) which had me wondering if at least some SES radios were actually being UCM equipped?

And while we're on the subject, I've been meaning to ask... The SES previously had access to all analogue (zone 1) police channels but what has happened with areas where the police have moved to encrypted P25 (zone 2)? Have SES radios been upgraded to follow them over to P25 with encryption and OTAR etc?

Andrew

[rustynswrail]

~ end result, some agencies will just upgrade their radios and go over to digital as they probly cannot justify going encrypted... examples being SES,RFS, Energy Australia, Railcorp ~

Funny you should mention that, there are two P25 GRN TGs that have been reported here with encrypted traffic (40051 & 40052) which are very close to an SES assignment of TGs (starting at 40068) which had me wondering if at least some SES radios were actually being UCM equipped? And while we're on the subject, I've been meaning to ask... The SES previously had access to all analogue (zone 1) police channels but what has happened with areas where the police have moved to encrypted P25 (zone 2)? Have SES radios been upgraded to follow them over to P25 with encryption and OTAR etc?
Andrew

Andrew,

I know from my days at VKG Penrith that the only SES units to have access to the analogue police system was the accredited road rescue units, in our case Hawkesbury, others did not. I believe very few if any external agencies have been give access to the P25 system. I think that is what channel X was created for, if that still exists.

R

[citabria]

...P25 with encryption and OTAR etc?...

They aren't using OTAR.

[Bigfella237]

They aren't using OTAR.

They must be using OTAR, how else can you de-key a stolen/missing radio OTA?

I know there's the Tactical Inhibit option but that's a little risky on the security side of things... TEKs are stored on the UCM and not deleted upon inhibiting...

[citabria]

They must be using OTAR, how else can you de-key a stolen/missing radio OTA?

Regular P25 Inhibit - the same as before they rolled out crypto. Either that or you simply don't bother and wait for the next manual rekey.

Either way, I know they are they are not using OTAR