NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Scotty
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Re: NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Post by Scotty » Tue Apr 22, 2014 12:23 pm

techman wrote:In NSW, it may not effect GRN but still could have an impact onto non GRN/police users.
Of course, that's the idea behind the embargo - being to force change on those users. But I'm not sure how that really relates?

matthewn1983
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Re: NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Post by matthewn1983 » Thu Apr 24, 2014 9:58 pm

Scotty wrote:
Bigfella237 wrote:...last I heard there are still ASPs and XTS3ks floating around, but I guess they would mostly be found in country areas these days?
Plenty of XTS3k's floating around in metro areas, especially during large events.
Image
(image from NSW Police Force: Dog Unit) - from the 2014 Royal Easter Show, Homebush. - spot the radio.

(Portable) Tender Link: https://tenders.nsw.gov.au/?event=publi ... D0C98AE93B

H98QDH9PW7 N- ASTRO APX 6000 Portable, UHF, R1, Model 3.5 Incld. Universal carry holder, standard black colour. Including: Model Numbers: G806, H38, Q361, QA01648, QA01767, G996, Q387, Q947, Q498, Q15, H43, H46, QA00782, QA01771, H799, PMMN4062, PMNN4403, NNTN7063. PMNN4403 - SPARE APX BATTERY IMPES STD IP67 LIION 2150MAH. NNTN7063 - APX IMPRES CHARGER MULTI-UNIT DISPLAY

G806 - ASTRO Digital CAI Operation
H38 - Smartzone Operation
Q361 - P25 9600 Baud Trunking
QA01648 - Advanced System Key - Hardware Key
QA01767 - APX 6000 Radio Authentication
G996 - Programming Over P25
Q387 - Multicast Voting Scan
Q947 - Radio Packet Data
Q498 - MC & ASTRO P25 OTAR W/MULTIKEY
Q15 - AES/DES,DES-XL,DES-OFB ENCRYPTION
H43 - Radio Trace/Remote Monitor
H46 - One Touch/Status Message
QA00782 - ENH: Enable Internal Activation and GPS Basic Functionality
QA01771 - ???
H799 - ADD: Test Result Printout

(Mobile) TenderLink: https://tenders.nsw.gov.au/?event=publi ... 3A168329D5
M25QSS9PW1 N - ASTRO APX 6500 Mobile, O3 5m Remote Mount UHF R1 380-470MHz, 2,000 Channels, 10-40 Watt, & Including: Option Numbers: G806, G51, G361, QA01648, GA01767, G996, G387, W947, G298, G851, G170, G683, GA00229, GA01771, G444, G72, G90, G67, GA00235, G89, B18, HKN6228, G79


Going by some pdf's found through Google Searching, with the above options in the USA, a 3.5 Model radio is around $3500USDea, estimated cost of Tender was around $330,000AUD- so approx 100 portable radios give/take a few. So the Dog units have a couple, and theres been some floating around the Sydney City CBD area on GD's for a few months now.

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Bigfella237
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Re: NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Post by Bigfella237 » Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:20 am

Great find Matt, so that's

Q-split APX6000 Portables, Flashcode RQ008R-011280-3, plus the following options:
Q15 - ADD: AES/DES,DES-XL,DES-OFB ENCRYPTION
H799 - ADD: PRINTED TEST RESULTS
PMMN4062 - IMPRES REMOTE SPEAKER MICROPHONE
PMNN4403 - IMPRES LI-ION 2150 MAH, SLIM, IP67 (battery) (x2 per radio?)
NNTN7063 - APX IMPRES CHARGER MULTI-UNIT DISPLAY (Aust, NZ Plug)

and Q-split APX6500 Mobiles, Flashcode 9Q108R-011280-7, plus the following options:
G851 ADD: AES/DES,DES-XL,DES-OFB ENCRYPTION
G444 ADD: CONTROL HEAD SOFTWARE
G72 ADD: O3 CONTROL HEAD
G90 ADD: NO MICROPHONE NEEDED
G67 ADD: REMOTE MOUNT
GA00235 ADD: NO GPS ANTENNA NEEDED
G89 ADD: NO RF ANTENNA NEEDED
B18 ADD: AUXILARY SPKR 7.5 WATT
HKN6228 CH Cable (male right angle CAN - female CAN)
G79 ADD: PRINTED TEST RESULTS

BTW, QA01771 is called "Enhancement Level 2" but I'm not exactly sure on what it includes, it's usually stuff like extra modes capacity.

Some interesting points among the above, namely all the trunking options are there (as you might expect if they're moving to the GRN soon) but P25 Authentication is included too.

And all radios get GPS but no onboard Bluetooth?

But perhaps the most interesting is that they have AES-256 (hmm...), although units like the doggies do regularly need to interop with just about everyone so it stands to reason they need the best radio gear, I guess some of the feds are on AES so they might just be observing the boy scouts' motto?

Geez, $330,000 seems like a shit-load of money for just a hundred radios...

Andrew
Last edited by Bigfella237 on Sat Apr 26, 2014 12:09 pm, edited 4 times in total.

matthewn1983
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Re: NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Post by matthewn1983 » Fri Apr 25, 2014 10:01 am

And all radios get GPS but no onboard Bluetooth?
Why would they get Bluetooth in their radios when they refuse to use them when driving a vehicle? [/rant]

techman
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Re: NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Post by techman » Fri Apr 25, 2014 1:40 pm

Tait to supply p25 base stations to police : -

https://tenders.nsw.gov.au/?event=publi ... C7F842A09C
https://tenders.nsw.gov.au/?event=publi ... 5BC12150BF
https://tenders.nsw.gov.au/?event=publi ... EE269B86D5

Looks like NSW Police will have a number of major changes/upgrades occurring this year
Don't like it, either get over it or retire

Scotty
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Re: NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Post by Scotty » Sat Apr 26, 2014 5:43 am

matthewn1983 wrote:So the Dog units have a couple, and theres been some floating around the Sydney City CBD area on GD's for a few months now.
Haven't seen any GD's with them anywhere (all the ones I see still have the XTS2500 in the city areas), but all the transport police now seem to have them around Central station. Maybe those are the ones that you are seeing?

Scotty
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Re: NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Post by Scotty » Sat Jun 26, 2021 5:47 pm

I have it on good authority that a new NSW Police radio profile has recently been rolled out to Sydney (and is apparently being rolled out statewide) which has a new zone which contains the following GRN channels:
- channels for 26 dispatch areas (ALPHA through ZULU)
- special ops channels for each PAC/PD statewide
- a large number of spare special ops talkgroups.

While we are all aware the police have been using the GRN for many years for specialist operations, it appears steps are well underway to transition everyday dispatch and GD operations over to the GRN.

For those that use Unitrunker, etc keep an eye out over the coming months for new talkgroups and RIDs.

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Bigfella237
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Re: NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Post by Bigfella237 » Sat Jun 26, 2021 9:30 pm

There would have to be more than 26 GD talkgroups because there's channels Alpha thru Zulu plus a handful of numbered channels (I recall "Channel 4" was out Quakers Hill way) plus however many networked back-channels will be replaced.

I know their "Zone 5" in the new radios has all the ESO Liaison channels and talkgroups (including GRN) because we were told we could liaise with police on-scene if need be. I know they can talk direct with rescue choppers too (non-encrypted simplex) but I can't remember the specific frequencies. I think it's the same as "AIR35" on the RFS radios, which I believe was the old analog ch65 on the PF radios.

Anyhow, I wouldn't hold my breath, GRN coverage has got a long way to go before the cops would even consider looking down their noses at it! :P

Scotty
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NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Post by Scotty » Sun Jun 27, 2021 11:52 am

Bigfella237 wrote:There would have to be more than 26 GD talkgroups because there's channels Alpha thru Zulu plus a handful of numbered channels (I recall "Channel 4" was out Quakers Hill way) plus however many networked back-channels will be replaced.
Yes and no.

While they do currently use 2, 4 and 5 for dispatch channels, I understand they don't use E, T, V or X - which means as it stands today they have a total of 25 dispatch channels. A switch to the GRN would be a perfect time to do an overhaul of the dispatch channels back to A-Z. At the end of the day though it’s just a name given to a channel.

The networked backchannels won't be needed either, as those backchannels have very specific coverage (wide-area, specific-location, tunnel, etc) and were patched in to provide additional coverage. A single GRN TG will be all that would be needed to cover all those areas (as long as there is GRN coverage of course!)
Bigfella237 wrote:Anyhow, I wouldn't hold my breath, GRN coverage has got a long way to go before the cops would even consider looking down their noses at it! :P
Yep, won't be overnight. However the fact that all these GRN talkgroups are now being programmed into all radios suggests it is finally something they intend on doing short-term. I could foresee them using it for backchannel/special ops purposes initially, maybe with areas (such as the North West of the state) that already have 'full' GRN coverage switching over first.

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Bigfella237
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Re: NSW Police Broadcasting On GRN

Post by Bigfella237 » Sun Jun 27, 2021 1:39 pm

Yeah, I thought the whole point of those CCEP upgrades to the GRN was to get the cops on-board in those areas, but that doesn't seem to have happened (that I know of anyway).

The cop on the ground (especially HWP and anyone else who travels) would get a huge benefit from being on the GRN (coverage issues not withstanding) because there's no more switching vote groups every time you pass through an area.

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